Rivergate Software Inc. - makers of DVDAfterEdit

Posted Jun 08,2005 4:59 PM harold

what methodologies have people used to burn dual-layer test discs for projects from 'Edit? i would like to have the layer break in the right place but i would prefer to avoid gear as it is not terribly inexpensive and requires moving the disc folder back to a windoze machine.

cheers,
h

Posted Jun 09,2005 2:50 AM promos

Hi Harold,

I've probably done about 50 or 60 dual layer titles using edit. I also own Gear Pro ME as I had to make use of that program prior to edit being available and before Apple fixed dvdsp.
First I choose my break point from the cells available, I then create the DLTs. Then I read the DLT's back as an image file. Then using the lastest Toast (it must be 6.1 or higher) I mount the image file and burn the test disc. Doing it this way ensures that the layer break is the same on the test disc, PLUS what your client is watching is exactly what is on the dlt.

Hope this is of use

Cheers

Tony

Posted Jun 09,2005 10:20 AM harold

hi tony,

thanks for getting back to me. if the latest version of toast puts break points in the correct place then i will give that a try.

i have a few more questions: reading the dlt back into an image file is certainly good for the warm-fuzzies of knowing that the test disc is the same as the tape, but should that affect the location of the break point? is there any reason not to just give toast the disc folder or a disc image generated by 'Edit? i ask because i would not be dying to write two tapes and read them back before burning a disc for internal review--especially as i only have one dlt drive. if that would not be a terrible idea, would using an image file generated by 'Edit or the disc folder be preferable?

cheers,
h

Posted Jun 09,2005 2:29 PM John Brisbin

Harold,

Tony's method generally works because of elements of necessity and elements of luck.

First, none of the readily understood disc image formats on Mac OS contain explicit information about the layer break on a DVD, if any.

Therefore, Toast evaluates the disc to determine an appropriate layer break point. If necessary, it will insert a non-seamless cell to make an appropriate layer break. With a TFDVDEdit image, however, this is never necessary since a dual layer image will always have at least one appropriate break already in place.

When the disc is very nearly full, there will probably be only one legal layer break and Toast will use the same layer break as TFDVDEdit did, and you will get an exact match with the tape.

The only awkward case occurs when the disc is significantly less than full, allowing more than one legal break, perhaps at one of several VTS boundaries or non-seamless cells. In such a case, Toast may well choose a different break than you did when you were presented with the option in the Mastering dialog.

While it does not represent exactly what is on the tape, it is usually of no consequence since any non-seamless cell is equally good as a practical matter, so long as it meets the other criteria for a layer break.

It should be noted, however, that Toast could do almost anything in its algorithm that results in a legal break, so unless you verify the position either with Toast's information or with a DVD info utility of some kind, the break may not match the tape.

John

Posted Jun 10,2005 1:40 PM okeanos

I'm still not sure why I can't image a DVD-9 to my hard drive from 'Edit and then use Toast to make the DL DVD from the image. If I understand what you've said above ("With a TFDVDEdit image, however, this is never necessary since a dual layer image will always have at least one appropriate break already in place.") then the layer break should be in place and Toast should be able to understand it. Unless, of course, there's a difference between the image that gets created going 'Edit -> Image versus 'Edit -> DLT -> Image.

Michael

Posted Jun 10,2005 2:12 PM larryapple

Hi Michael,

There is no need to go to DLT first if you are going to burn from an image. True, the DLT will have information about the actual layer break chosen, but this information is lost when making an image from the DLT.

Actually there is no need to make an image either. If you open the folder containing the VIDEO_TS folder in TFDVDEdit and then save, it will force a non-seamless cell at the chosen layer break. Then that cell would be available to Toast as a possible layer break.

I don't have a dual-layer recorder, so I can't report first-hand about tests with Toast. We do know that it can choose a cell nearest the middle of the data, instead of enforcing layer 0 to be larger than layer 1.

Regards,

Larry

Posted Jun 11,2005 3:57 AM promos

Hi

The reason I write the tape first and then read it back is because I have had occations in the past where for some obscure reason, data was different on test discs supplied to a client and subsequent dlts. So this way I know what they are signing off is the same as what I deliver to the replcator. Not all clients get replicator samples like they should and this gives me added prtoection from them saying it was my fault.

Its really a kinds of, lets me sleep at night thing. :-)

Cheers

Tony

Posted Jun 11,2005 1:00 PM okeanos

Makes perfect sense...though won't an image extracted from tape include any copy protection and/or region bits?

I just wanted to understand the necessity of that step to the process of burning DL discs.

Michael

Posted Jun 11,2005 7:31 PM promos

Yes it would, but none of the distributors I work for bother with copy protection anymore.

Cheers

Tony